{ "version": "1.0.0", "segments": [ { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "0.558", "endTime": "3.016", "body": "The first antivirus I ever used was Norton." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "3.739", "endTime": "4.938", "body": "I was young and broke," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "5.144", "endTime": "7.5", "body": "so I think I borrowed a copy off of LimeWire." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "8.326", "endTime": "11.053", "body": "Looking back now, it's probably not a great idea" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "11.053", "endTime": "14.09", "body": "to get your antivirus software from a peer-to-peer network." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "14.978", "endTime": "17.292", "body": "Anyways, I always felt a little better" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "17.292", "endTime": "19.957", "body": "having that little icon always in my task." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "19.4", "endTime": "24.805", "body": "bar, supposedly protecting me, yet somehow my computer always ended up getting infected." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "25.585", "endTime": "32.452", "body": "After Norton, I moved to ESET Nod32. They don't have it anymore, but back in the day," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "32.652", "endTime": "37.036", "body": "they had a cool-looking robot logo that looked like it was straight out of the iRobot movie." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "37.797", "endTime": "43.262", "body": "After that, I finally settled on Malwarebytes, after using it to help remove a worm that infected" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "43.262", "endTime": "48.907", "body": "a company I worked for, and seeing how well it worked at cleaning up friends and family's laptops" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "48.907", "endTime": "54.933", "body": "that were riddled with malware. All of that to say, I never used a McAfee antivirus," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "55.113", "endTime": "61.679", "body": "but I've always been fascinated with the story of the founder, John McAfee. This episode contains" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "61.679", "endTime": "65.783", "body": "some adult material, so if you don't want to hear it, or you have children around," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "66.043", "endTime": "70.767", "body": "you may want to skip it. From a charismatic and unpredictable salesman," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "70.967", "endTime": "75.872", "body": "to pioneering the antivirus industry, on this episode of In The Shell." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "78.935", "endTime": "81.217", "body": "Okay, why we're not shipping Windows 98? Absolutely." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "81.758", "endTime": "85.141", "body": "Mr. Jobs, you're a bright and influential man. Here it comes." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "85.941", "endTime": "89.925", "body": "It's sad and clear that on several accounts you've discussed, you don't know what you're" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "89.925", "endTime": "96.771", "body": "talking about. The key to success is developers, developers, developers, developers, developers," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "97.272", "endTime": "100.675", "body": "developers, developers, developers, developers, developers, developers, developers, developers." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "100.775", "endTime": "105.94", "body": "Janice and I don't own phones. Neither should you people, if you have any common sense." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "108.022", "endTime": "113.627", "body": "My name is Josh, and I'm able to keep this podcast independent and advertisement-free" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "113.627", "endTime": "118.712", "body": "because of support from listeners like you. If you are finding value in what I'm doing here," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "119.252", "endTime": "125.318", "body": "consider becoming a paid supporter at members.sideofburritos.com. And as a thank you," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "125.638", "endTime": "130.823", "body": "members get early access to new videos, ad-free versions of everything, bonus content," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "130.823", "endTime": "136.849", "body": "and access to a live monthly Q&A. Thanks for considering. Now let's get back to the show." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "138.21", "endTime": "144.296", "body": "John McAfee's journey began far from the tech corridors of Silicon Valley. Born in the United" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "144.296", "endTime": "151.923", "body": "Kingdom in 1945 and raised in Virginia, USA, his early years were marked by turmoil. His father," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "152.143", "endTime": "159.109", "body": "an abusive alcoholic, cast a long shadow over his childhood, a trauma that would haunt McAfee for life." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "160.17", "endTime": "166.877", "body": "Every day I wake up with him, he admitted in 2012, reflecting on the painful memory of his father's" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "166.877", "endTime": "173.443", "body": "suicide when John was just 15. Despite the instability at home, McAfee displayed early" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "173.443", "endTime": "179.989", "body": "flashes of ingenuity. While studying at Roanoke College, he launched a magazine business with a crafty" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "179.989", "endTime": "186.375", "body": "twist. The magazines were free, but he charged customers for shipping. I'm explaining to them why" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "186.375", "endTime": "192.32", "body": "it's not free and why they are going to pay for it, he later laughed, but the ruse worked and I made a" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "192.32", "endTime": "199.066", "body": "fortune. This mix of confidence and cunning would become a McAfee trademark. Yet those same college" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "199.066", "endTime": "204.732", "body": "years also revealed his self-destructive tendencies. He drank heavily and squandered his earnings on" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "204.732", "endTime": "212.019", "body": "alcohol. He enrolled in a PhD program in mathematics, but was expelled after a scandalous affair with a" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "212.019", "endTime": "219.505", "body": "student whom he later married. Drifting between jobs in the late 1960s, he picked up computing skills" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "219.505", "endTime": "225.151", "body": "working on punch card systems and eventually landed a position at Missouri Pacific Railroad" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "225.151", "endTime": "232.898", "body": "programming train schedules. But by then, his experiments with drugs had escalated. McAfee would show up to work" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "232.898", "endTime": "241.326", "body": "high on LSD, pushing the boundaries of his mind and his sanity. One fateful day, he took an entire bag of" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "241.326", "endTime": "249.473", "body": "DMT in one go. Within an hour, my mind was shattered, he later recalled. The experience cost him his job" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "249.473", "endTime": "257.08", "body": "and nearly his grip on reality. By the 1970s, McAfee was a gifted programmer bouncing between prestigious tech" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "257.08", "endTime": "262.165", "body": "jobs, including stints at NASA, Xerox, and GE, while spiraling" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "262.165", "endTime": "268.975", "body": "deeper into substance abuse. He was brilliant, but increasingly volatile. Hitting rock bottom" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "268.975", "endTime": "275.504", "body": "turned out to be a dark blessing. In 1983, after waking up from yet another Coke and Scotch binge" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "275.504", "endTime": "281.853", "body": "at his desk, McAfee finally sought help in Alcoholics Anonymous. He got sober and rebooted" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "281.853", "endTime": "287.421", "body": "his life just in time for a fateful encounter with a new kind of technological menace," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "287.621", "endTime": "292.007", "body": "one that would transform him from a wayward genius into a tech pioneer." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "293.029", "endTime": "300.699", "body": "By 1986, John McAfee was working as an engineer at Lockheed in Silicon Valley when news surfaced" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "300.699", "endTime": "307.369", "body": "of something unprecedented, a self-replicating program called the Bryan Virus, the first of its" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "307.369", "endTime": "314.639", "body": "kind to spread via floppy disks on IBM PCs. Where others saw a looming threat, McAfee saw an opportunity" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "314.639", "endTime": "321.004", "body": "he immediately called a colleague, electrified by the prospect of what he later described as a" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "321.004", "endTime": "328.46", "body": "game-changing moment. Steve Morgan, a colleague and biographer, recalled, John instantly dialed" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "328.46", "endTime": "333.612", "body": "up a programmer he knew and said there's a big opportunity. We need to write some code" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "333.612", "endTime": "341.21", "body": "to combat this virus. In 1987, McAfee quit his job and founded McAfee Associates" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "341.21", "endTime": "349.251", "body": "with a single mission, to fight computer viruses. McAfee's approach was as unconventional as the man" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "349.251", "endTime": "355.252", "body": "himself. He created VirusScan, one of the first antivirus programs for personal computers," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "355.455", "endTime": "361.173", "body": "but instead of selling it in shrink-wrapped boxes like traditional software, he distributed it as" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "361.173", "endTime": "367.113", "body": "shareware through electronic bulletin board systems, an early online channel predating the web." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "367.113", "endTime": "370.598", "body": "This was a revolutionary strategy in the late 80s." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "370.939", "endTime": "376.346", "body": "Users could download VirusScan for free from McAfee's home base BBS in Santa Clara," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "376.807", "endTime": "381.654", "body": "test it out on their infected systems, and pay a registration fee if they found it useful." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "382.295", "endTime": "388.263", "body": "This distribution model helped McAfee's software spread faster than the threats it was designed to eliminate." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "389.445", "endTime": "391.488", "body": "VirusScan introduced a key innovation." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "391.488", "endTime": "397.676", "body": "It was one of the first all-in-one virus scanners capable of detecting multiple viruses at once." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "398.097", "endTime": "403.344", "body": "Before this, security researchers typically wrote separate tools for each new virus," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "403.525", "endTime": "407.59", "body": "a cumbersome approach in a rapidly evolving threat landscape." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "408.852", "endTime": "413.559", "body": "VirusScan wasn't groundbreaking in its complexity, but the idea was transformative." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "414.079", "endTime": "419.587", "body": "John McAfee, a one-man software shop, had effectively launched the antivirus industry." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "421.07", "endTime": "427.331", "body": "The timing was perfect. As personal computers proliferated, so did anxieties about security" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "427.331", "endTime": "434.147", "body": "breaches. From his modest California home, McAfee's fledging company took off. By the late" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "434.147", "endTime": "441.623", "body": "1980s, McAfee Associates was reportedly earning $5 million annually, as major corporations adopted" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "441.623", "endTime": "448.007", "body": "his software to safeguard their business systems. In an era when few had ever heard the term" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "448.007", "endTime": "454.783", "body": "cybersecurity, John McAfee was turning it into a booming industry. Remarkably, he did it all" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "454.783", "endTime": "462.423", "body": "without outside investors, relying instead on a direct-to-user mail-order model, an early bootstrap" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "462.423", "endTime": "469.569", "body": "tech startup before that became the Silicon Valley cliché. McAfee's brash personality and the growing" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "469.569", "endTime": "473.544", "body": "effectiveness of his own software quickly made him a go-to medium." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "472.061", "endTime": "473.968", "body": "media expert on computer viruses." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "475.133", "endTime": "479.107", "body": "I see infections of small companies where every computer has become infected," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "479.689", "endTime": "482.44", "body": "and the company is near collapse from financial loss." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "482.64", "endTime": "487.699", "body": "Virus expert John McAfee, president of a newly formed computer virus association," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "488.161", "endTime": "490.329", "body": "helps companies recover from attacks." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "490.67", "endTime": "493.942", "body": "But the true explosion of public awareness was yet to come," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "494.103", "endTime": "497.515", "body": "sparked by a single word, Michelangelo." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "498.78", "endTime": "504.722", "body": "In early 1992, a new computer virus named Michelangelo began making headlines." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "505.324", "endTime": "509.118", "body": "Unlike most viruses at the time, this one had a built-in trigger." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "509.359", "endTime": "513.133", "body": "It was programmed to activate on March 6th, the artist's birthday," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "513.675", "endTime": "515.542", "body": "destroying data on infected machines." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "516.606", "endTime": "521.002", "body": "Computer users won't be joining in all the celebrations for Michelangelo's birthday this Friday," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "521.002", "endTime": "524.535", "body": "because on that day, a new and deadly virus is scheduled to strike." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "524.535", "endTime": "530.172", "body": "computers around the world. Sensing an opportunity, John McAfee seized the moment." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "530.533", "endTime": "537.694", "body": "In February 1992, he issued a dramatic warning. Michelangelo could potentially wipe data from up" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "537.694", "endTime": "543.29", "body": "to 5 million computers, a catastrophe in the making. The media ran with the story," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "543.671", "endTime": "550.01", "body": "amplifying the panic. Competitors in the young antivirus industry echoed similar dire predictions," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "550.01", "endTime": "556.67", "body": "and newspapers splashed ominous headlines. Virtually overnight, computer security became" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "556.67", "endTime": "563.108", "body": "a front-page concern. As March 6th approached, people around the world anxiously booted their" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "563.108", "endTime": "570.811", "body": "PCs, fearing mass data loss. John McAfee, ever the showman, positioned himself as the antivirus" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "570.811", "endTime": "577.009", "body": "savior with the cure in hand, his software. Thousands rushed to purchase antivirus tools." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "577.009", "endTime": "581.284", "body": "hoping to shield their machines from the impending digital disaster." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "582.338", "endTime": "586.005", "body": "But when the day arrived, the apocalypse never materialized." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "586.856", "endTime": "589.469", "body": "Michelangelo turned out to be more hype than havoc." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "590.077", "endTime": "595.122", "body": "The day of techno-doom turned out to be a dud, the Associated Press reported dryly." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "595.669", "endTime": "601.099", "body": "Instead of the millions predicted, only an estimated tens of thousands of computers were actually infected." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "601.787", "endTime": "606.751", "body": "At Boston University, just three out of the 2,000 campus computers were hit." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "607.4", "endTime": "611.634", "body": "Global corporations like AT&T reported only a handful of cases." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "612.08", "endTime": "615.544", "body": "For McAfee, it hardly mattered that Michelangelo fizzled." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "615.848", "endTime": "618.583", "body": "The scare had achieved exactly what he had intended." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "618.988", "endTime": "621.237", "body": "It made antivirus software essential." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "622.169", "endTime": "626.728", "body": "Before Michelangelo, computer security was an afterthought for most users." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "627.052", "endTime": "629.483", "body": "Many didn't even realize viruses existed." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "629.483", "endTime": "635.612", "body": "alone feel the need to buy software to combat them. That changed almost overnight. In the wake" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "635.612", "endTime": "642.802", "body": "of widespread fear, McAfee became a household name in cybersecurity. Later that year, McAfee" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "642.802", "endTime": "650.393", "body": "Associates capitalized on the momentum and went public, raising $42 million in its IPO. A new" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "650.393", "endTime": "655.72", "body": "multi-million dollar industry had been born, and John McAfee had just ridden its first wave" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "655.72", "endTime": "661.308", "body": "to fortune and fame. With millions in his bank account, and his company now a Silicon Valley" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "661.308", "endTime": "667.216", "body": "powerhouse, McAfee's lifestyle had shifted dramatically. No longer just an entrepreneur," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "667.557", "endTime": "673.225", "body": "he was becoming a full-fledged eccentric. He bought a massive estate in Woodland Park, Colorado," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "673.666", "endTime": "679.474", "body": "where he built a yoga retreat, experimented with meditation, and dabbled in holistic medicine." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "680.295", "endTime": "681.957", "body": "He was about absolute f***ing." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "681.957", "endTime": "687.669", "body": "Freedom. Once I realized I had f**k you money, he later admitted, I'd just stopped caring what" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "687.669", "endTime": "693.441", "body": "people thought. Critics later accused McAfee of exaggerating virus threats to drive sales," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "693.744", "endTime": "697.74", "body": "with some even whispering conspiracies that he might have created the virus himself," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "698.103", "endTime": "704.178", "body": "a claim overwhelmingly denied by those who worked with him. But the truth was more nuanced." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "704.925", "endTime": "710.939", "body": "Michelangelo was real, with McAfee's team documenting around 60,000 infections, hardly" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "710.939", "endTime": "717.741", "body": "insignificant. And he wasn't the only one raising alarms, but he was the loudest. His talent for" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "717.741", "endTime": "724.058", "body": "stirring public fear was a mix of genuine concern and marketing genius, blurring the lines between" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "724.058", "endTime": "730.698", "body": "caution and opportunism. As one journalist quipped, it was hard to tell where McAfee's paranoia ended" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "730.698", "endTime": "734.431", "body": "and his sales pitch began. The problem is getting worse." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "734.431", "endTime": "739.739", "body": "We're seeing a new virus arrive on the scene at the rate of about one a month now." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "740.119", "endTime": "744.746", "body": "Most of the new viruses are worse than the old viruses because they are more subtle," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "745.046", "endTime": "748.271", "body": "more sophisticated, and they cause a great deal more damage." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "748.671", "endTime": "753.839", "body": "Regardless of intent, the Michelangelo incident cemented John McAfee's status" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "753.839", "endTime": "756.262", "body": "as the godfather of antivirus software." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "757.584", "endTime": "763.793", "body": "Inside McAfee Associates, John McAfee's personality was as legendary as his media exploits." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "764.474", "endTime": "768.94", "body": "Charismatic and unpredictable, he inspired fierce loyalty among employees" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "768.94", "endTime": "772.325", "body": "who saw themselves as warriors in a digital battlefield." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "773.466", "endTime": "776.13", "body": "It felt like we were saving the world from computer viruses" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "776.13", "endTime": "780.616", "body": "or connecting humanity through the internet, one early staffer recalled." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "781.157", "endTime": "784.963", "body": "To McAfee, this wasn't just business, it was war." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "785.644", "endTime": "786.905", "body": "He thrived on..." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "786.905", "endTime": "793.374", "body": "competition, wielding intellect and aggression to outmaneuver rivals. His intensity was electrifying" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "793.374", "endTime": "799.123", "body": "to allies and intimidating to adversaries. The culture was as wild as its founder." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "799.603", "endTime": "805.431", "body": "Employees described a workplace that felt more like a counterculture tech cult than a traditional" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "805.431", "endTime": "811.54", "body": "software company. There were late-night coding marathons fueled by energy drinks, fast food," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "811.54", "endTime": "818.45", "body": "and according to some employees, even stronger substances. Here's a clip from the 2016 Showtime" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "818.45", "endTime": "823.978", "body": "documentary, Gringo, The Dangerous Life of John McAfee, that sums up the culture." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "824.598", "endTime": "830.507", "body": "Three of the women were supposedly witches, and they would sit in the conference room and have" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "830.507", "endTime": "839.039", "body": "like a little chant. Andrea Nation would come in in the morning with a bottle of Windex and clean off" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "839.039", "endTime": "839.379", "body": "Do-" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "839.379", "endTime": "844.869", "body": "Larson's desk, because there was a sex contest going on, you get points." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "845.113", "endTime": "854.973", "body": "They had a group called Little Foxes, where they would give points for having sex in different" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "854.973", "endTime": "856.173", "body": "spots of the office." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "857.575", "endTime": "862.719", "body": "John being this free spirit, that made the culture of the company." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "864", "endTime": "865.809", "body": "It was the Wild West." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "866.236", "endTime": "867.416", "body": "John loved chaos." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "868.046", "endTime": "871.766", "body": "He thought it made people more creative, one former executive recalled." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "872.376", "endTime": "874.125", "body": "And for a while, it did." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "874.572", "endTime": "880.224", "body": "By the early 90s, McAfee Associates was raking in millions, and John was being hailed as" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "880.224", "endTime": "881.078", "body": "a tech visionary." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "882.054", "endTime": "887.096", "body": "As you can probably guess, John was never one to follow the rules, in business or in" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "887.096", "endTime": "887.401", "body": "life." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "887.909", "endTime": "891.853", "body": "That philosophy fueled both his innovation and his reputation." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "891.853", "endTime": "894.958", "body": "He loved eccentric designs and unfiltered honesty." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "896.119", "endTime": "901.066", "body": "When antivirus researcher Veselin Banchev applied for a job in the early 90s," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "901.667", "endTime": "903.83", "body": "McAfee rejected him with a bizarre excuse," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "904.431", "endTime": "910.56", "body": "claiming falsely that the U.S. government suspected Banchev, a Bulgarian, of being a Soviet spy." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "911.121", "endTime": "914.605", "body": "It was the strangest way to say no, Banchev later laughed," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "915.026", "endTime": "917.93", "body": "recalling McAfee's paranoia-tinged response." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "917.93", "endTime": "923.278", "body": "When they eventually met at a conference, Banchev found him just weird," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "923.658", "endTime": "926.462", "body": "far from the button-up executive one might expect." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "927.584", "endTime": "931.249", "body": "By the early 90s, McAfee Associates was thriving," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "931.529", "endTime": "935.275", "body": "but John McAfee himself was growing increasingly erratic." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "935.655", "endTime": "939.741", "body": "His unconventional leadership style had always been part of the company's DNA," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "940.041", "endTime": "944.327", "body": "but as success mounted, so did his paranoia and unpredictability." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "944.327", "endTime": "950.27", "body": "It was like we were saving the world, one employee said, but his leadership could turn chaotic." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "950.773", "endTime": "955.688", "body": "One day he'd be throwing impromptu office parties, the next storming through the halls," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "955.95", "endTime": "958.126", "body": "convinced spies were sabotaging the company." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "959.354", "endTime": "963.806", "body": "Traditional corporate structures didn't interest him. Rules were for other people." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "964.491", "endTime": "969.487", "body": "Meetings could be interrupted by sudden outbursts or physical demonstrations of his latest obsession." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "969.487", "endTime": "975.53", "body": "John would sometimes show up in a full karate GI, barefoot in the middle of the day, an employee recounted," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "976.577", "endTime": "978.551", "body": "just to practice his moves in the office." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "979.176", "endTime": "986.266", "body": "Others remembered the old shotgun he kept propped up against his desk, not for security, just because he liked the way it looked." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "987.273", "endTime": "991.886", "body": "By 1992, McAfee had fully embraced his larger-than-life persona." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "992.289", "endTime": "996.801", "body": "He fueled public fears about computer viruses, amplifying hysteria." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "996.801", "endTime": "1000.305", "body": "while positioning himself as cybersecurity's last line of defense." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1001.191", "endTime": "1006.064", "body": "Some employees began to wonder, was he truly on a mission to stop digital threats," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1006.225", "endTime": "1008.4", "body": "or was he simply obsessed with control?" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1009.527", "endTime": "1013.333", "body": "As McAfee's fame grew, so did his distrust of the world." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1013.957", "endTime": "1019.676", "body": "Even as McAfee Associates raked in millions, he became obsessed with the idea that he was being watched." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1020.058", "endTime": "1026.804", "body": "He spoke of government agencies monitoring him, convinced they wanted to steal his technology, or silence him." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1027.71", "endTime": "1034.455", "body": "He installed multiple phone lines at his home, each with a different purpose, some allegedly to throw off eavesdroppers." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1035.16", "endTime": "1041.886", "body": "He refused to drink from an open bottle unless he had watched it being opened, fearing enemies might try to poison him." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1043.315", "endTime": "1046.195", "body": "Eventually his paranoia bled into his personal life." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1046.738", "endTime": "1049.275", "body": "Always a thrill seeker, skydiving." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1049.275", "endTime": "1055.6", "body": "racing motorcycles, experimenting with meditation and hallucinogens. McAfee's behavior became" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1055.6", "endTime": "1061.563", "body": "increasingly erratic. He would disappear for days without explanation, sometimes returning with" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1061.563", "endTime": "1067.586", "body": "radical new ideas, other times with a haunted look in his eyes. Running a traditional company" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1067.586", "endTime": "1073.931", "body": "no longer interested him. When I started, there were four of us. We were making millions and life" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1073.931", "endTime": "1082.069", "body": "was simple. Now I had a thousand bosses, the SEC, the FTC. I was an accountant instead of an engineer." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1082.935", "endTime": "1090.852", "body": "In 1993, he stepped back from daily operations, and in 1994, he left McAfee Associates entirely." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1091.416", "endTime": "1097.439", "body": "The company was thriving, and two years later, he sold his remaining stake for around $100 million." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1098.426", "endTime": "1101.749", "body": "Most entrepreneurs would have settled into a comfortable retirement." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1101.749", "endTime": "1107.482", "body": "but John McAfee was not most entrepreneurs. His departure wasn't the end of his story." }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1107.722", "endTime": "1114.497", "body": "It was the beginning of something far stranger. John McAfee's name remained synonymous with" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1114.497", "endTime": "1120.43", "body": "digital security long after he walked away from the company that bore it. McAfee Associates," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1120.811", "endTime": "1126.503", "body": "later renamed McAfee Inc., continued to grow, becoming one of the most recognizable names in" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1126.503", "endTime": "1135.703", "body": "cybersecurity. In 2011, Intel acquired the company for a staggering $7.7 billion. Yet even a tech" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1135.703", "endTime": "1141.897", "body": "giant like Intel couldn't erase the McAfee brand. After a failed attempt at rebranding, the name was" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1141.897", "endTime": "1148.15", "body": "restored, proving its lasting power in the cybersecurity market. But McAfee's legacy runs" }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1148.15", "endTime": "1154.223", "body": "far deeper than the corporate logo. Every antivirus update, every cybersecurity headline," }, { "speaker": "Josh", "startTime": "1206.697", "endTime": "1212.604", "body": "Take care, and I'll see you next time." } ] }